Working Dogs

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 For Sale 

• Photos and info on our dogs
• Click here for an open letter to our buyers and buyer testimonials of our puppies. 
• Breed info
• Why choose a Great Pyrenees for a Livestock Guardian Dog (LGD)?
• Would one of your pups make a good household pet?
• What is the Volhard PAT and why is it important to me?
• How do I train my puppy to be a guardian?
• A few "training" tips when bringing home your new puppy. 
• What basic training should my LGD have?
• Can my pup be both a livestock guardian AND a household pet?
• Will my LGD be okay on smaller acreage?
• Can LGD be used for guarding poultry?
• Do Great Pyrenees really wander? 
• Livestock Guardian Dog jump gates....how do I build one and do they really work?
• Should I shave my Great Pyrenees in the summer?
• How many LGD do I need?
• What are the benefits if I buy a puppy from Cornerstone Acres Farm?
• Can a young Livestock Guardian Dog (LGD) be trusted with my stock? 
• How much does a large LGD eat?
• How do I keep my LGD from going through my fence? 
• Do LGD bark a lot? 
• Do I have to wait 2 years to put my pup with livestock?
• Can I buy two puppies at the same time? 
• How often do you breed your females?

COMING SOON:

Have a question you need answered? Use the "contact us" form and we will  respond to your question privately and then we can also post the question and the answer here for other readers.

The short answer is no, never shave a Great Pyrenees.  

The long answer is actually that it depends.  There are rare cases where I would say yes you need to TRIM your dog or perhaps even shave.  Times like if they are matted beyond simple grooming or if your dog will be having surgery (the vet will shave what is necessary).  

A double coated Pyrenees with a good clean coat will be best left UNSHAVED.  Our first male, Reign, had a coat that required  a bit more grooming to avoid the dreaded matting.  Our next male, Bruno, and our female, Icee, have VERY maintenance free coats that lend to full shedding of the undercoat without help, no mats and "natural" cooling abilities.  I could type up WHY leaving a good clean coat intact rather than shaving is best, but the infographic below shows it much better than I can.

Check out the picture for a good visual. .https://albertnorthvetclinic.wordpress.com/2013/05/30/shaving-your-dogs-coat-should-you-or-shouldnt-you/

At our farm we have lots of visitors. We wanted a breed that would protect from both four legged predators and aerial predators. We needed a compromise between protective yet friendly. The Great Pyrenees (or Pyr) was our choice. They have been bred for intelligence and the ability to think on their own. A working dog often does not have the benefit of a shepherd or shepherdess out in the field to direct him in his duties. Just as they are loyal if kept as a loving house pet, they are just as loyal to their charges in the field. Many ranchers prefer to have at least a pair of these amazing dogs since they work very well in teams. How many you need will completely depend on your preferences, your set up and your predator situation. Their main method of protection is to be a deterrent. This is accomplished by LOTS of barking. As a general rule Pyrenees are people friendly dogs, or at the very least NOT generally people aggressive which is almost imperative if you have many farm visitors. There are other breeds of guardian dogs out there which also cross well with the Pyrenees breed. Some of these breeds are the Anatolian, Akbash, Komondor, Kuvasz, Maremma and less commonly the Tibetan Mastiff.

Our Great Pyrenees are NOT registered. We are not into showing, but raising wonderful companions and livestock guardians. Our main goals are raising and breeding dogs that have unquestionable loyalty, dependable gentleness, unwaivering guardian skills and easy to maintain hair coats. Ours do tend to be a bit larger in size than the "breed standard".

The following was copied from

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/greatpyrenees.htm

and is a general breed description.

The Great Pyrenees is also known as the Pyrenean Mountain Dog. The length of the dog is slightly longer than it is tall. The head is wedge-shaped with a slightly rounded crown and is in proportion to the rest of the body. The backline is level. The muzzle is about the same length as the back skull. The skull is as wide as it is tall with flat cheeks. There is no apparent stop. The nose and lips are black. The teeth meet in a scissors or level bite. The dark brown, medium-sized eyes are almond shaped and slanted. The dark brown, V-shaped ears are carried low, flat and close to the head, rounded at the tips, and set about eye level. The chest is fairly broad. The well-feathered tail reaches the hocks and can be carried low or up over the back in a wheel when the dog is excited. There is sometimes a crook at the end of the tail. The Great Pyrenees has single dewclaws on the front legs and double dewclaws on the hind legs. The dog has a weather-resistant double coat. The undercoat is dense, fine and wooly, and the outer coat is long, thick, coarse and flat. There is a mane around the shoulders and neck which is more apparent in male dogs. There is feathering on the tail and along the back of the legs. Coat is either solid white or white with patches of tan, wolf-gray, reddish-brown or pale yellow.

The Great Pyrenees is a capable and imposing guardian, devoted to its family, and somewhat wary of strangers—human and canine. It is often used to guard livestock. When not provoked, it is calm, well-mannered and somewhat serious. Courageous, very loyal and obedient. Gentle and affectionate with those he loves. Devoted to family even if self-sacrifice is required. It is very gentle with its family and children. It does best with children when it is raised with them from puppyhood, and if it is not being used as a working flock guard be sure to socialize it well with people, places and noises. It has an independent nature, and may try to dominate or intimidate a less secure owner, and/or an owner who treats the dog as if he is human becoming stubborn or territorial. Owners need to be firm but calm. Be confident and consistent with the dog Setting rules: the dog must follow and stick to them. The Great Pyrenees is a serious worker, but very independent. Be patient when training the Great Pyrenees, as it may be slightly difficult. If left alone inside the home without the proper amount of exercise and / or leadership it can become destructive. The Great Pyrenees is good with  non-canine animals, and usually loves cats. These dogs do not reach maturity until they are about 2 years old. Some are not good off the leash and may wander away. They need an owner who understands and practices natural dogmanship. The Great Pyrenees tends to bark a lot and some tend to drool and slobber.

Height: Males 27 - 32 inches (69 - 81 cm) Females 25 - 29 inches (63 - 74 cm) are the average heights, but some Pyrenees are as tall as 40 inches (1 meter)
Weight: Males from 100 pounds (45 kg) Females from 85 pounds (38 kg)

Prone to bloat, hip dysplasia, bone cancer, luxated patellas. Can develop skin problems in very hot weather.

These dogs are not recommended for apartment life and would do best with a mid-to-large sized yard. They need space, but adapt well to family life. They are not really active indoors, but need regular exercise outdoors. A fence is a must as they may wander away in search of the borders to what they believe is their territory. Puppies are very active and might have the tendency to wander off or escape. Prefer cool climates.

Pyrenees need plenty of exercise to stay in shape. If they are not actively working as flock guardians, they need to be taken on a daily,  long brisk walk.

Life span:  About 10-12 years

Coat maintenance: Regular brushing of the long double coat will keep it in good condition, but extra care is needed when the dog is shedding its dense undercoat. The outer coat does not mat unless there is a burr, foxtail or some other outside object that gets stuck to the coat. This can be an issue for outside working dogs. Some owners choose to shave the coats in the summer to avoid this from happening, but beware of sunburn. Bathe or dry shampoo only when necessary. Great Pys shed all year round but do so heavily once a year.

The Great Pyrenees originated in Central Asia or Siberia. The breed was descended from the Hungarian Kuvasz, and the Maremmano-Abruzzese.The Pyrenees is also a relative of the St. Bernard. contributing to its development. It has a long history as a guard dog of sheep. The dogs made their way to Europe; the Great Pyrenees remained in the high mountain regions until the Middle ages, when the breed gradually gained popularity with the French nobility as a guard dog. By the late 17th century, every French noble wanted to own one. Armed with a spiky collar and thick coat, the Great Pyrenees protected vulnerable flocks from such predators as wolves and bear. The Great Pyrenees has proven to be a very versatile breed working as an avalanche rescue dog, as a cart-puller, sled dog, as a pack dog on ski trips, a flock guardian, dog of war, and as a companion and defender of family and property. The AKC officially recognized the Great Pyrenees in 1933.

Also here is a link to the AKC breed standard for the Great Pyrenees

http://www.akc.org/breeds/great_pyrenees/breed_standard.cfm

There are many reasons why we think we offer a great plan for pairing you with that ideal puppy (or puppies) and we offer tons of support for as long as it's needed!

1) We offer Volhard Puppy Aptitude Testing (along with our daily observations) to help optimize the best placement potential of each puppy.  We are better able to rate pups as strong independent working dogs or more docile loving pets. Please note that the Volhard test WAS built with service dogs in mind, however we feel it still does give us a bit more insight into the temperament of the LGD pups. We will gather most of our information on the temperament and personality of our pups from daily observations. 

2) We raise dogs well socialized with stock.  Our pups aren't born in the house and raised only within the same property of livestock - they are born in the barn with the stock.  We do keep pups in a secured area to avoid any mishaps with a goat stepping on a tiny newborns.  They do however share an open stall wall with the goats....the smell and sounds of goats is no surprise to the pups as they grow up!  Somewhere between 2-3 weeks of age the stall where the pups are born is no longer closed off.  From this point on pups have full access to the goats, chickens and ducks.    Although our current females were born and raised with stock, our older male (Bruno) was brought into our farm at 18 months of age from a pet home.  However all dogs display natural and strong LGD (Livestock Guardian Dog) skills. 

3) We offer a lifetime of support for any pup or dog that leaves our farm.   We offer support in the form of problem solving, training help and rehoming if ever necessary.  We are willing to take any dog back at any time.  We have actually set up our farm and pastures just so we can offer this.  To date we haven't had to take any back, but we are always here to do so.  If you do ever rehome your dog, we still offer these services to whomever you sell him/her to.   No pup that leaves our farm should EVER end up in a shelter or rescue. 

4) We are frank and tell it like it is.  We would rather be brutally honest about the pluses and pitfalls of owning a Great Pyrenees.   They are NOT for everybody and they are NOT for every situation.   We aren't here to sell puppies.  We are here to propagate a wonderful working dog and share the joys AND honest sorrows of owning such amazing dogs.  You shouldn't leave our farm with your new puppy to encounter any hidden surprises. 

5) Our dogs and our puppies are healthy. Our livestock that our dogs are housed with is also healthy.  Nothing leaves our farm sick or debilitated OR exposed to sick or debiltated animals.

6) Our pups are socialized with humans enough to allow them to become gentle and loving pets, but raised hands off enough that they settle in extremely well to any new guardian home.  

7) We hold our pups to an age that is ideal for allowing important learning and training here from their parents before they leave.   This still also allows them to go to their new homes during that critical bonding time to help with creating strong and long-lasting bonds their new stock and/or family.

8) Our pups go home with a small bag of their current food, their age appropriate shots, a microchip, wormed and a record of all pertinent information (including all known pedigree information).    

I have been asked this question quite often.  I also wonder if I have been giving the wrong impression with the other information I have mentioned.  Here are my thoughts......of course other people may have had different experiences and different dogs that shape their opinions.  For what it is worth, they are honestly not much different than any other breed in the wander/not wander respect....and tend to wander only if not given a proper job (whether it be guarding family or livestock).  If you feel you can leave a dog outside alone unsupervised (either by adults or children) then yes they may wander and that could be the same with any breed.    There are many Pyrenees that are pets that don’t wander.   I think that some may misunderstand the reason why mine are behind fences……the goats DO wander if not in a fence!   To be a yard dog or a house dog any breed would require basic training to remain within their boundaries and I don’t think you would have an issue as long and you are willing to put just as much training into a Pyrenees as you would with any other dog (and probably a little less as they just don’t have the nose of a hound, the prey drive of a retriever or the herding/chase instinct of a shepherd).  Their primary directive so to speak is to take care of their charges and “their” property.   In the role of LGD (livestock guardian dog) where predator pressure is high they WILL chase predators, they WILL patrol property and if you don’t have a good fence they WILL wander outside the confines of your pasture.   As I have mentioned above….. for a pet home a good fence, close supervision and responsible training in some combination, may be necessary to keep them within their borders.  Each dog is an individual of course, but basically the training wouldn’t be any harder than for any other breed of dog.  In general, as a breed the Great Pyrenees bond VERY STRONGLY to their charges (whether it be a herd of goats, a flock of chickens or a family). I am not trying to talk anybody into a dog that they don’t think will work for them, but I do hate the thought of people going away with the wrong impression of the breed.   I am only one person with one persons volume of personal experience....and remember that the next person who tells you that their Pyrenees has a bad case of wanderlust is also only one person with only their experience to influence their opinions.

A jump gate is a good means to allow your dog access to places that you may not want your stock (sheep or goats or otherwise) to go.  Our first jump gate was built to keep the goats from going into our LGD's doghouse when she whelped her first litter of pups. 

How do I build a jump gate?   A picture is worth a million words so below is my best answer to that question.

Do jump gates really work?  For us they have.  We have had a few smaller (younger) goats go thru the one pictured as it is in a hog panel and a little lower to the ground.  Per the notes in the picture a height slightly higher off the ground would be recommended. 

How do jump gates work?   The theory behind it is that due to the triangular shape the animal has to somewhat cross it's legs to get through....this is to streamline the shoulder width a little and allow passage.  

Where should I (or shouldn't I) use a jump gate?  I use them to give the dogs access to multiple pastures where I would rather keep the stock in those pastures separated.  I use them to give the dogs a place to eat or whelp away from the stock.  I would NEVER recommend using a jump gate in a perimeter fence, only in cross fencing. 

Are jump gates 100% foolproof?  Nope.  We have had a few younger of our does figure out the one in the picture...I'd never say anything is foolproof when it comes to goats!!  However we have had great success and even though I give dimensions on the one above but you may have to play around a little with the sizing and height of your gate.  

Check out the video of our dogs using the gate here:  

https://video.fagc3-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t42.1790-2/10704452_717627854979744_1241097161_n.mp4?_nc_cat=111&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=985c63&efg=eyJybHIiOjY5MSwicmxhIjo1MTIsInZlbmNvZGVfdGFnIjoic2QifQ%3D%3D&_nc_ohc=wwBRWGogQesAX8niouM&_nc_oc=AQnX6eTosYh1lZPK7kbtHvFJ_u9GKNqirHB7GiTBWVpYVhxcjK543w-v_N6qV2mUWSG-7biqdj8C0fRmmctpiKny&rl=691&vabr=384&_nc_ht=video.fagc3-1.fna&edm=AGo2L-IEAAAA&oh=00_AfB_Wqi5PZIk4Kzz93D5fxJkduTQ2eTFTXg0dCoD5BtYWw&oe=64D43C60

(See also "Can a young dog be trusted with livestock?")

The short answer is no.   The long answer is also no.  The in between answer is most likely not.

This is a popular misconception as well as (IMO) a way for breeders to excuse or hide poorly bred pups.  A pup should be raised with stock whether or not you have an older dog.   Will you need to be part of the training process?  Of course.  Should you expect losses as a natural course of doing business...that is an emphatic NO.  So how can it or should it be done?  There is SO much to describing this situation of a young pup with stock that I can't possibly get it all here, but I'm going to try.  

First off there is very much a difference between the statements "A LGD can't guard efficiently until they are 2 years old" and "A LGD can't be left with stock unsupervised until they are 2 years old"  The first may be true and is the statement that the dogs just can't defend and do their job physically or mentally depending on the predator pressure you have and the size of your dog.   A 12 week old pup isn't much more than prey itself for eagles, coyotes or even bears.   But pit them physically against a fox and they most likely would win.   BUT a 12 week old pup doesn't generally have the mental acuity to decipher and thwart a threat.  A 1 year old pup on the other hand may have the size to dispatch a single coyote attack, but most likely won't have the mental savvy to deal with a pair or more of cunning coyotes.  

As far as the second statement, A pup may NOT work well right off the bat unsupervised with poultry or young stock like lambs or kids.  However waiting 2 years is bunk.  A pup (especially a bored one) can very easily see these like sized animals as siblings and therefore play things!  A chicken can't tolerate the amount of mouthing and jumping as a true dog sibling can and disaster can happen.  Supervision, interaction and training is the key if you don't have any other dogs to help show the ropes to a new pup. Keeping a pup with adult stock (but away from stock who are actively birthing) is a great way to allow your pup to learn the ropes safely.   ANY AND ALL play or actions that including touching livestock with mouth or paws should be immediately reprimanded and stopped.  This is where adult stock is recommended with a young pup, they can and will protect themselves from a small puppy when you aren't around and you can reinforce any training while you are present.   

For poultry guardians, we do recommend caution when leaving your pup with stock.   Having a closure to retire an over stimulated pup to as well as other GOOD stimulation for your young pup to keep him from trying to run off energy with the birds is a good idea.  Giving a pup experiences with a broody mother hen or a new mother duck helps train your dog that chicks and ducklings are most definitely NOT fun to play with and are off limits!

No matter what, an LGD IS a dog, albeit a different type of dog with sometimes different training methods and that training is important in the early months of life.   Waiting until a dog is 2 years old to try and discourage behaviors that weren't able to be expressed is going to make your life, your dogs life and your stocks life much more miserable. 

 <iframe src="https://www.facebook.com/plugins/video.php?href=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2FCornerstoneAcresFarm%2Fvideos%2F1223032697772588%2F%3Fref%3Dembed_video&show_text=0&width=560" width="560" height="315" style="border:none;overflow:hidden" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true" allow="autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowFullScreen="true"></iframe>

Yes they can. 

I think that there are some limits, but not in the way most take them or assume them to be.

The commonly seen comment "Dogs can't be trusted  with stock until they are 2 yrs of age" is a statement that I believe has gotten skewed from the original statement that dogs can't guard well until around age 2.  These are two totally different statements. The first part - dogs can't be trusted with stock until 2 years of age -  is generally a very inaccurate statement. 

I might not let a dog be on his/her own without some sort of back up (human, strong fencing, safe barns, another dog, etc) until age two. But that doesn't mean that they can't be with stock alone until then, just that they may not have the mental or physical strength to thwart an attack prior to that.  

Now, I don't allow a young dog to be with birthing mothers until I KNOW how they will respond. However all our dogs ARE with adult or junior stock from day one. There can be a difference in the way a dog perceives a birthing mother or a newborn kid and I see no reason to take chances without supervising this delicate time.  Although I've never had an issue with a dog over two with newborns or kidding does, I've also never had problems with dogs UNDER two.   

Keep in mind however that not all dogs are suitable to be with all stock, it's just a fact that all dogs ARE individuals.   Just because I haven't had problems with my current and past dogs doesn't mean that some dogs may be more apt to problems.   I say this last part just because I feel that too many people also take for granted the "magical" properties of these dogs.   They are NOT magical, they are living creatures who can and do make mistakes and will require your guidance.  Use common sense and when in doubt ask someone for help and err on the side of caution.  

There is no one amount I can give you, but I can give you an idea.  While they are big dogs, they are neither high energy dogs nor are they big eaters.   As of the writing of this paragraph, I have two adults (over 2 years old) and one teenager (approximately one year old).   On average, I go through 50# of mid-grade dog food in about 1-1/2 weeks.  We also go through periods where  we utilize raw feeding (too hard to give you an idea of how much we go through in raw feeding).

Do Great Pyrenees bark excessively? Yes they CAN. However if you ask me if mine do, the answer is no.There are a few things I have observed over the years. 1) barking happens most with dogs under 2 or older dogs that are new to an area/farm. 2) barking happens much less if the dog has another dog to learn from (or a human). Why do they bark so much in the beginning? Because they are learning. Everything new is a threat, the neighbors driving by, the bag blowing around outside the fence, the deer passing through on the neighbors property.   They need to learn what kinds of things aren't a threat. They may take a long time to realize the resident turkey flock or deer herd isn't going to eat their animal charges. They may never realize that the neighbor kids playing tag in their own yard is nothing to fret over. This is where you come in! Being available to guide your dog is important. Teach them some sort of "enough" command.  There is a fine line between teaching them not to bark at all (probably won't happen)and teaching them to bark only at true threats.  Of course you still want them to alert to danger. Barking IS their first line of defense....scaring predators away is much safer than letting them get into the pasture and THEN having to deal with them! Don't assume however that because you see or hear nothing that there isn't something to bark at.  Being able to gauge what is nuisance barking and what is alert barking is the tricky part. Barking that lasts more than a few minutes I usually investigate. As my dogs get older I can easily tell which dog is barking and what kind of bark it is. If they are barking at the neighbor dog playing fetch, I stop them. If they are barking because the neighbor dog is by the edge of the road near our fence,  I allow it as they are doing what they are supposed to do. The sound and intensity of the barks are usually noticeably different. They will bark at bicyclists as they go by, but stop quickly once they are gone. That's okay. They bark at cars who stop to gawk at the animals. That's definitely okay. They bark at the neighbor kids going buy....I stop that most times.  The kids sometimes are a bit boisterous, but I don't like them barking at kids.  So to sum up. Yes they bark, but they can be trained. They will usually learn what they need to bark at (and what they don't) by the time they are 2 years old all on their own. However most people don't want to wait that long (or take a chance that some types of nuisance barking may get ingrained). You can train them to the "hush/enough/stop/shut up" command to help them learn faster and better. You can even train them TO bark at certain things. When we got our first GP, bald eagles were our biggest problem. We would sit in the pasture with our pup and bark at any large birds (crows, hawks, buzzards or eagles). She learned to watch the sky and doesn't bother with little birds. She's also taught all subsequent dogs to do the same. 

Going over?  Electric fence or google "Fence Top Rollers Dogs".  There are mixed reviews on the roller, but electric is definitely proven to work.  

Going under?   There are a few ways to manage this behavior.   1) electric fence - one strand a foot off the ground 2) fill holes as you find them using their own feces to fill (yep gross, and the dogs usually think so too) NOTE:  A dog can dig out easily in under an hour, if relying solely on this method you just might lose your dog.  3) put stones,  wire or heavy bricks around the perimeter of your fence line. 4) attach "loose" fencing to logs at the bottom if there is too much play in the fence allowing dogs to push under

My short and quick answer here is no.  As a general rule I would prefer not to offer pups in pairs, but in full disclosure I have done it a couple of times to buyers I felt had full information of what raising two pups entails as well as the resources to give them the proper training to allow them to become healthy functioning adult dogs.  I've raised pairs myself with good success so I know it is possible, but I also know it isn't easy.  Anyone willing to sell you two pups without discussing the pitfalls of doing so probably won't have the best interests of the pups or you at heart. 

Take a look into "Litter mate Syndrome".  Keep in mind this is NOT limited to actual litter mates, but can be an issue when getting two pups of similar ages at the same time even if unrelated.  Many people think that having two puppies at the same time can give the pups someone to play and bond with and therefore make the whole puppy stage easier.  However two pups growing up together presents a whole set of different issues than if you have one.   With two pups, each must have one on one training with their shepherd/owner as well as training with each other.  So rather than making things easier, you have effectively tripled the amount of training you must actually do.   Often with two pups, their bonding will be very strong with each other and they will look to each other for comfort, cues and bonding instead of looking to the stock or their shepherd.   

Is raising two pups impossible?  No it isn't.  

Is it easy? No it isn't.   

I highly recommend spacing your pups out at least 6 months and preferably about 1 year.  

We breed our females almost every heat.  We get flack often for this because many people are under the impression that breeding "back to back" is detrimental to the dogs.  We have discussed with our vet and breeding this way is completely fine as long as the bitch remains in great condition.  Also stopping and spaying once their litter sizes begin to decline.  You can check for yourself within the Facebook group "Pet Vet Corner"  Where only veterinarians are allowed to answer questions.  There are a few threads where the main consensus of multiple vets is that back to back is totally fine and even beneficial to a degree.